The History of Cream

[Bearhugger]

Again, I am not debating what the case was for Region I, and is now the case for Region IV. Not sure why everyone is up in arms now, but the fact of the matter is......it isn't right, regardless of who it affects. It wasn't right when it happened to Region I and it isn't now either. So as adults who have dedicated a large portion of our time and life to the worlds greatest sport, we can just say "well I had to deal with it when it wasn't fair, so too bad so sad for you", or we can really look at the situation and try to come to a resolution that will be a long term fix, put the best kids in the state tournament, and help our sport gain some traction.

Yes, this is called learning. I am glad we as humans have learned along the way in history. I would hate to see the lines at the outhouses at Big Sandy. Thank God somebody didn't accept outhouses as to how life HAD to be going forward. I like running water. I also like a strong state tournament filled with the best the state has to offer.

[Bearhugger]

Found this interesting and had no idea it was this lopsided so i thought i would look at the individual rankings and compare them to the teams in region 4. As we all know the top 4 in the region qualify for the state tournament. The following weight classes will have kids ranked in the top 10 in the state but will not qualify for state.

wt. top 10
113 6
120 6
132 6
138 5
145 5
152 5
170 5
182 5
So 11 kids ranked in the top 10 in their weight class by the coaches will not qualify for the 16 man bracket at the state tournament. To me this is a shame.

This is just half of the picture. We also have to wait and see who the other qualifiers are from the other three regions. It could be some wrestlers that were one of only four wrestlers(instant qualification) and also have records with 25% wins and 75% losses.

[Bearhugger]

I believe that South and Parkersburg would get the same amount through regardless of the region they are in.

If Parkersburg and Parkersburg South were still in region 1 this season, they would have an easier time than they do now.

[Bearhugger]

Found this interesting and had no idea it was this lopsided so i thought i would look at the individual rankings and compare them to the teams in region 4. As we all know the top 4 in the region qualify for the state tournament. The following weight classes will have kids ranked in the top 10 in the state but will not qualify for state.

wt. top 10
113 6
120 6
132 6
138 5
145 5
152 5
170 5
182 5
So 11 kids ranked in the top 10 in their weight class by the coaches will not qualify for the 16 man bracket at the state tournament. To me this is a shame.

Best I can tell before re-alignment.
Region I
2016
106 4
113 6
120 3
126 3
132 3
138 3
145 4
152 4
160 3
170 4
182 5
195 4
220 5
285 3
4 not getting out of region
2015
106 3
113 5
120 3
126 4
132 3
138 4
145 3
152 4
160 6
170 3
182 4
195 5
220 2
285 4
4 not getting out of region
2014
106 3
113 3
120 4
126 2
132 4
138 4
145 5
152 5
160 6
170 3
182 2
195 4
220 5
285 3
5 not getting out of region
2013
106 4
113 4
120 4
126 3
132 4
138 6
145 6
152 4
160 5
170 4
182 6
195 4
220 5
285 4
8 not getting out of region
2012
106 2
113 5
120 4
126 2
132 3
138 4
145 6
152 4
160 5
170 6
182 6
195 5
220 5
285 3
10 Not getting out of region

Just saying, this is not a new situation. It's been going on for years.

Using your numbers, here is my takeaway:

2016 = 4 ranked wrestlers not qualifying.
2015 = 4
2104 = 5
2013 = 8
2012 = 10

I see a downward trend from 10 down to 4. Either region 1 has been getting weaker or the rest of the state it catching up.

Region 1 should do very well this season in regard to ranked wrestlers making it to the states. There are fewer ranked wrestlers in region 1 to begin with and South/PHS are out of the way.

[RWWS]

Great wrestlers have not been qualifying for years.

[vortexfan]

Great wrestlers have not been qualifying for years.

That's the point, so is that something we're all proud of
and not try to improve from past history?

HS football playoffs in the 70s used to be 2 teams then 4 teams then 8 teams and now "Lo and Behold" its 16 teams!

Now looking at that which is better for the sport of HS football today? Look at the revenue too the more football those other players get to play. (I've seen posts it's about the money) One site for the north region and one for South region.

Why not improve this great sport? Two regionals two days and the top 8 go, 16 man bracket for he states!

[mike.carman]

Found this interesting and had no idea it was this lopsided so i thought i would look at the individual rankings and compare them to the teams in region 4. As we all know the top 4 in the region qualify for the state tournament. The following weight classes will have kids ranked in the top 10 in the state but will not qualify for state.

wt. top 10
113 6
120 6
132 6
138 5
145 5
152 5
170 5
182 5
So 11 kids ranked in the top 10 in their weight class by the coaches will not qualify for the 16 man bracket at the state tournament. To me this is a shame.

Best I can tell before re-alignment.
Region I
2016
106 4
113 6
120 3
126 3
132 3
138 3
145 4
152 4
160 3
170 4
182 5
195 4
220 5
285 3
4 not getting out of region
2015
106 3
113 5
120 3
126 4
132 3
138 4
145 3
152 4
160 6
170 3
182 4
195 5
220 2
285 4
4 not getting out of region
2014
106 3
113 3
120 4
126 2
132 4
138 4
145 5
152 5
160 6
170 3
182 2
195 4
220 5
285 3
5 not getting out of region
2013
106 4
113 4
120 4
126 3
132 4
138 6
145 6
152 4
160 5
170 4
182 6
195 4
220 5
285 4
8 not getting out of region
2012
106 2
113 5
120 4
126 2
132 3
138 4
145 6
152 4
160 5
170 6
182 6
195 5
220 5
285 3
10 Not getting out of region

Just saying, this is not a new situation. It's been going on for years.

Using your numbers, here is my takeaway:

2016 = 4 ranked wrestlers not qualifying.
2015 = 4
2104 = 5
2013 = 8
2012 = 10

I see a downward trend from 10 down to 4. Either region 1 has been getting weaker or the rest of the state it catching up.

Region 1 should do very well this season in regard to ranked wrestlers making it to the states. There are fewer ranked wrestlers in region 1 to begin with and South/PHS are out of the way.

That is kind of my point and the same will happen in region IV as time goes by.

[mike.carman]

To put the two different historical snapshots into perspective to what is happening today, here are the same 29 schools with their current total number one ranked wrestlers (per the January 12, 2017 individual rankings):

Region 1:
Brooke 0
Buck Up 0
John Marshall 0
Morgantown 0
Preston 0
University 0
Wheeling Park 1
Total Region 1 1

Region 2:
Hampshire 0
Hedgesville 0
Jefferson 0
Martinsburg 0
Musselman 1
Spring Mills 0
Washington 0
Total Region 2 1

Region 3:
Capital 0
George Washington 0
Greenbrier East 0
Princeton 0
Riverside 1
South Charleston 0
St. Albans 2
Woodrow Wilson 0
Total Region 3 3

Region 4:
Cabell Midland 0
Huntington 0
Hurricane 0
Parkersburg 2
Parkersburg South 6
Ripley 0
Spring Valley 1
Total Region 4 9

Summary
1. 29 AAA schools’ total history: 554 state champions. 323 from the new region 4. 323 / 554 = 58.30%

2. 29 AAA schools’ past 5 year history: 58 state champions. 35 from the new region 4. 35 / 58 = 60.35%

3. 29 AAA schools’ current #1 ranked wrestlers (as of January 12, 2017) 14 #1 ranked wrestlers. 9 from the new region 4. 9 / 14 = 64.29%

The cream always rises to the top and approximately 60% of the time, it is happening with the new region 4 schools. The other 40% is scattered across THREE other regions.

Enjoy!

Sorry Bear. I see you were talking about one ranked wrestlers. My fault.

I must have missed something.

You did but I was able to edit it right away. I didn't realize you were talking about #1 ranked wrestlers, I thought you were just talking about ranked wrestlers. Nothing to worry about.

[mike.carman]

I am confused as to why "it's been this way for years" is a justifiable argument to not fix something. Just because something has been a certain way, does not make it what's in the best interest of the sport, kids, or state tournament. In all that I have read, the best idea so far is the North/South Region and take best 8 out of both. Region 1 was stacked for many years, now it's Region IV......I just don't understand why it has to be any Region that is so lopsided. I cannot grasp why the historically dominant teams can't be spread around. "That's the way it's always been" is a ridiculous reason to not tweak or fix something.

All anyone is saying is that it has been that way for years and no one had a problem with it before, why is everyone up in arms about it now? I live in region I and we dealt with it for 30 years. Has the competition at regional tournaments been weekend for us? Yes. Do I think it will always be that way? No. Everyone is operating under the assumption that Region IV will always be overly dominant. That is not going to be the case.

And quite honestly, we really are only talking about the AAA division anyway. There are a lot more wrestlers staying home who are good and they wrestle for A/AA schools. And some of them could very easily beat some of AAA top 10 ranked kids anyway.

I do not see any team taking over and leaving South, Parkersburg or Huntington back in 8 through 20th place for the next 10 years.

Time will tell on this. All empires fall in due time.