wvmat.com

The dreaded pill will be drawn at this time next week and to me, it is the most anticipated attraction to culminate the seasons ending. What upsets will take place in next weeks regions, which wrestlers that deserve to see each other in the finals will face off in the semi's, what exciting match ups will be seen on each and every round, all will be told. Whether you are in agreement with the 'pill' selection, all has to agree that it brings an added excitement to the final showdown of the season. This season, I really believe that what pill that is drawn will not make a difference to which teams wins it all. But personal match-ups will still be the highlights. Wrestling-the best sport ever.

The Pill is simply a crutch for lazy administrators to avoid having to expend the effort to develop and utilize a better, more fair method of pairing wrestlers.

The Pill is simply a crutch for lazy administrators to avoid having to expend the effort to develop and utilize a better, more fair method of pairing wrestlers.

And it does NOT bring ANY added " excitement ".

It's a fair system and not unlike many other states.

The pill is a JOKE!! It seems to me that the State tournament should be seated by a select group of people that know wrestling . That said ,they should do away with the regionals in AAA and run a 32 man bracket. This would not only save money lost on some of the Regionals but would be more money taken in at the State Tournament. Seat the top 8 and blind draw the rest . Not hard and wont take alot of time. In closing i hope that the WVSSAC takes time out to get the right weight classes and dates on the it awards. This happened a few years ago and the WVSSAC promised to make good and we are still waiting!!

I like the pill over some 'select' committee who would be limited to what they have seen, heard, or know and would come with their own biases. Its not always as simple as Wrestler A beat Wrestler B. It can become very complex by the end of the season. Id rather stick with the unbiased pill.

To be the best, you have to beat the best. Why do we care about the pill so much!? It's a fair system. If you have two good wrestlers meet in the semis so be it. I look at it as the guy who wins is the best in the state.

Well, I usually stay out of these discussions, but...

If we were seeding (ranking) AAA 160 for next weekend, how would we seed it??

Long of Hurricane has defeated Casto StA twice, Eckleberry JM, Roach PP, McIe Univ, Simpkins WP, and Fischer CM twice. However he lost to Goss Mgt.

Casto StA has defeated Fischer CM. However he lost to Roach PP this weekend.

Fischer CM has defeated Goss Mgt, Eckleberry JM, McIe Univ, and Roach PP. He lost to Long Hurr twice and Casto StA.

Simpkins WP has defeated Eckleberry JM, Goss Mgt, McIe Univ, and has split with Dunbar PS.

Dunbar PS has defeated Eckleberry JM, Goss Mgt.

Goss Mgt has defeated Long Hurr, Eckleberry JM, McIe Univ. Lost to Swisher Hamp;

McIe Univ defeated Eckleberry JM. Has lost to Long PP, Fischer CM, Simpkins WP, and Goss Mgt

Eckleberry JM has defeated Roach PP. Has lost to Long PP, Simpkins WP, Dunbar PS, McIe Univ, and Goss PS.

Roach PP defeated Casto StA, but has lost to Long, Fischer.




Weight Class 160
1. Hunter Jones, George Washington: Runner-up 170 2015 States; md Swafford WW; p Cornell SV; p Young Shady; d Long Hurr 8-5; d Casto StA 10-1; p Doyle Muss; d Dunbar PS 6-2; md Fischer CM; p Bo
Winf; p Armes Rivers; Champ Winners; Champ Stover; Champ MSAC;
2. Trevor Johnson, Huntington: Fifth 160 2015 States; tf Cornell SV; d Swafford WW 8-2; p Morgan Rip; d Chase Morgan Rip 9-3; Champ NCanton; tf Graham Park; md Fischer CM; p Roach PP; 2nd MSAC;
3. Chase Morgan, Ripley: Qualifier 145 2015 States; p Arms Riv; d Eckleberry JM 11-1; d Dunbar PSouth 8-6; d Simpkins WP 10-4; 3rd NCanton; d Goss Mgt 9-7; d Long Hurr 5-4 and 3-2; md McIe Univ; p Taylor Brk; p King Park; p Modessit Park; p Lamb LC; d Casto StA 6-2; d Dunbar PS 7-2; 3rd MSAC; p Saniago PS;
4. Dustin Swisher, Hampshire: p Goss Morgant; p Cornell SV; md Pusateri Hedg; p Arndt Muss; p Tennant Jeff; p Clark SpM;
5. Daniel Long, Hurricane: p Armes Rivers; d Casto StA 7-2; d Young Shady 6-4; p Campbell GbE; p Cress Prs; d Eckleberry JM 7-5; md McIe Univ; d Simpkins WP 7-1; md Shifflet Elk; p Herbert BU; p Daly Winf; d Roach PP 8-5; d Fischer CM 6-3; 4th MSAC; d Fischer CM 3-1; d Casto StA 3-1;
6. Isaiha Casto, St Albans: p Armes Rivs; p Campbell GbE; p Williams PP; d Devaney Nitro 4-1, 5-0; p Hartley CM, 3rd Nitro; p Cress Prest; d Fischer CM 6-3; 6th Winners; d King Park 7-2; p Lamb LC;
7. Hunter Fischer, Cabell Midland: Qualifier 132 2015 States; p Michaelson Riv; p McIe Univ; 5th Doan; p Tomasso Winf; d Graham Park 1-0 170; d Goss Mgt 6-0; p Lamb CM; d Ekleberry JM; d Roach PP 2-1;
8. Kaleb Simpkins, Wheeling Park: d Eckleberry JM 7-2; md King Park; 5th OVAC; d Goss Mgt 5-0; d McIe Univ 7-0; d Dunbar PS 6-1 have split;
9. Drew Dunbar, Parkersburg South: p Foster BU; 5th NCanton; d Simpkins WP 4-1; p King Park; d Eckleberry JM 5-1; d Goss Morg 3-1OT; 7th OVAC; p Cornell PS; p Modessitt Parkersb; p Zombeck Brk;
10. Tristan Goss, Morgantown: Qualifier 152 2015 States; p Elbon Elk; d Long Hurr 5-4; d Eckleberry JM 1-0, 2-0OT; d McIe Univ 9-4, 5-3OT; 8th OVAC; tf Modessett Park;


Ryan Young, Shady Spring: Qualifier 170 2015 States; p Williams PP; p Armes Rivers; p Campbell GbE; p Hartley CM; 2nd Nitro, d DeVaney Nit 12-8; d Cornell 8-3 split at Winners, 7th Winners; 2nd Coalfield; d Thomas SS 10-3 have split;

Jacob Thomas, Greenbrier East: p McCoy PP; p McClure StA; d Criddle SS 13-10 182; p Sewell WW; Champ BNI; d Young SS; 3rd Coalfield;

Braxton Cornell, Spring Valley: Qualifier 182 2015 States; tf Sewell WW; p Arndt Muss; p Clark SpM; 4th HolHam; p Herbert BU; d Young SS 8-5; 8th Winners; p Lamb LC;

Matthew McIe, University: d and md Williams PP; 5th SPhoto; p Cress Prs; md Arndt Muss; d Eckleberry JM 9-3; d King Park 3-2; p Taylor Brk;

Jalen King, Parkersburg High: p Frampton Winf; p Herbert BU 160; tf Williams PP 160; p Shriver mgt 160;

Marshall Eckelberry, John Marshall: p Foster BU; p Cress Pres; d Sine Muss 5-1; 2nd Cameron; d Roach PP 6-3;

Andrew Roach, Point Pleasant: p Battaile GbE 182; d Clawges Mgt; p Sine Muss; p Wilson BU; d Casto StA 5-4;

Tom Pusateri, Hedgesville: 4TH Horz; p Tennant Jeffx2; d Herbert BU;

Leslie Campbell, Greenbrier East: d Williams PP 8-5; 3rd Coalfield 170;

Zack Hartley, Cabell Midland: p Bo, Winfield:

Vincent DeVaney, Nitro: p Butler, Cap; 4th Nitro; p Williams WW;

Russell Shiflett, Elkins: p Davis Mgt; p Herbert BU;

Ryan Williams, Woodrow Wilson:

Kameron Cale, Spring Mills: p Albrecht Hedg; d Cress Prest 8-7;

Tomasso Bo, Winfield:
Sean Foster, Buckhannon Upshur:
Cody Herbert, Buckhannon Upshur:
Hunter Sewell, Woodrow Wilson:
Ryan Young, Shady Spring:
Christopher Fagga, Hampshire:
Cody Lamb, Lewis County:
Jacob Adkins, St Albans:
Brian Clark, Spring Mills:
Gage Elbon, Elkins:
Alec Cress, Preston:
Jackson Tennant, Jefferson:
Bailey Butler, Capital:

Its because they are worried some guy might finish...third...instead of second. Or..perhaps they feel he deserves to be on the big stage at the end going for first simply for that experience. I get it. But in the end, like you said, the best guy in going to finish first. And even if they used a select committee...we would still have people complaining their guy got jipped. At least with the pill there are not allegations of intentionally seeding someone higher to benefit team A or B etc.

Another "committee" is unnecessary. Folks would gripe about who was on the committee followed by complaints of who was seeded.

I'm excited to hear how 160 should be seeded.

You can never please everyone. The "pill" method appears to be the fairest without room of influence. And I agree with the others that the best wrestler should be able to come out on top no matter. If second and third is a concern, wrestle a true second place.

Just "swallow the pill" and wrestle!!!

The only argument I have ever heard against the pill is that it can allow for the two best wrestlers in a given weight class to meet before the finals.

I have had a doable solution for a month now but I have not had time to type it all out.

It could be implemented next season.

Coming soon.

With all do respect to Dr. Miller... Yes, seeding would be complicated but how is it that the WSAZ and OVAC manage to do it each and every year?
Heck let's just draw a " pill" for the Regionals too. If the argument from some is that the Pill is the most fair way of organizing a tournament then why do the Regionals seed their wrestlers???

Truesouthfaninhunt wrote:With all do respect to Dr. Miller... Yes, seeding would be complicated but how is it that the WSAZ and OVAC manage to do it each and every year?
Heck let's just draw a " pill" for the Regionals too. If the argument from some is that the Pill is the most fair way of organizing a tournament then why do the Regionals seed their wrestlers???

I think you misunderstand what the pill is intended to do. Its not seeding anyone. Its simply determining where to place wrestlers in the bracket based on their placement at regionals. So, obviously it could not be used for regionals, since there is no sectional tournament.

WSAZ and OVAC seed. They do the best job they can given the number of wrestlers entered. But, go look and see how often the top 6 seeds do not finish in that order. Its likely rare for all six of them to even place. My point is it is not going to work out any better.

Maybe this will help some folks.

http://www.wvmat.com/statetou/seeds.htm

The link takes you to the three possible pills to be released Saturday night. Using the pill for regionals isn't possible currently the way it's designed.

Regional Saturday is possibly the most exciting day of the season for many. Wrestlers get to see their draw for states and fans get to see matchups against other regions.

Has anyone seeded 160 yet?

As for 160...I think the posted rankings are good for how they would be seeded..maybe move Roach in there somewhere.

I agree with coach Stump, it is the "dreaded pill" and is highly anticipated. I think most peoples complaint is you end up with top 2 kids wrestling in semis. We all want to see them in the finals, but what about weight classes with 3 or 4 equally good kids. You still end up with them in semis. This years examples would be AA 126 White, Robertson, Secrist, McCune or AA 152 Ritchie, Michael, Shuman, Elliott. I understand that certain matchups work out better for certain kids, but seeding doesn't guarantee those matchups either. The classes with 3 top kids may be tougher, either way seeded you end up with possible championship match in semis.Example,last years AA 120 had Cam and Logan Robertson wrestling in semis, they wrestled in the finals the year before.It could have been Cam and Corey Secrist in semis or Robertson and Secrist in semis. Any way you seed that one is tough. Another complaint I've heard is that the pill draw is secret and done after the regional results are known.This leads to suspicions and speculation (most likely unfounded). Do the pill draw live on WSAZ sports at 11:15 Saturday night with 3 "Lottery Balls". Seeding meetings can be a fiasco, and someone always leaves mad. I understand using the "pill", make it fun. Ultimately it comes down to the old adage "if you want to BE the best you have to BEAT the best". One of the reasons this sport is so great is that it teaches life lessons:1 work hard for what you want, 2 life isn't always fair, 3 anything worth doing is worth do right, and many more. Don't mean to ramble, just snow day thoughts.

Wouldnt the easiest situation be to seed the 4 champions of each pill 1-4 and let everything else remain as is? All the criteria needed would be the final individual rankings

mscoach64 wrote:Wouldnt the easiest situation be to seed the 4 champions of each pill 1-4 and let everything else remain as is? All the criteria needed would be the final individual rankings

Yes! Look for what I have been working the past hour on.

A record is ONLY a number. For an example, you cannot go off the notion that the regional champion in 4 can beat the runner up in region 1 just because they have a better record. Maybe they have never wrestled. Not to mention the difference from when season starts to when season finishes when viewing performance. The pill simply PLACES the wrestlers in an UNBIASED position to wrestle. It is what it is.

thanks for clearing up my confusion regarding the pill... All along I thought it seeded wrestlers!

And your argument that the OVAC and WSAZ don't always get it right.... is missing the point. Seeding helps provide that the best two kids in each weight class, will have a higher probability of meeting for a championship in THE championship round. Some degree of seeding is done even with the Pill as 1s wrestle 4s, 2s vs 3s in each pill scenario in the opening round. Since the argument in favor of the Pill is that it doesn't matter when kids face one another then ... Heck, why not have 1s vs 2s in the opening round!!!!

The pill also can adversely affect team scores as well by preventing the second best wrestler from scoring second place points. Example: If the best two kids meet in the semis instead of the finals then the loser is prevented from scoring second place points. Instead the best he can score is 3rd place points.
The pill is a joke.

The week is getting more exciting as regional brackets are being posted and we await the pill Saturday night. The pill does add excitement for our sport.
I like the pill for several reasons.

One reason is that it allows a kid who has gotten better throughout the season to showcase themselves at regionals. Their overall record might not be so hot but what's important is the regional qualifier and how they place.

Another reason is scheduling. Due to the geography of our state some teams are able to wrestle more out of state teams. Through no fault of anyone it's just easier for them to travel 30 minutes and wrestle. Consider teams like Braxton, Nicholas, Lewis etc. who are more centrally located and are more likely to wrestle more in state teams. Now consider teams in either panhandle who have to travel a long way to see teams down south and vice versa. It would be difficult to find head to head or common opponents. The pill eliminates this problem.

Let's be honest. How many coaches would fix their schedule so they avoid certain opponents? Do you seed a kid #1 or #2 who has minimal losses because they wrestled an easier schedule and avoided tougher opponents? I recall a young man from Huntington High School several years ago who qualified for the state tournament with a losing record. This young man also wrestled his way into the finals. He did this without his coach attending a seeding meeting. The "human element" of seeding would not only happen at the seeding meeting. It would begin as soon as they began making their schedules for next season, throughout the season, and during dual/tournament matches.

Go Pill!!